Vietnam Vets On The Internet Who Hate POW/MIA Activists

In all my years of fighting for the return of abandoned U.S. prisoners of war, I have never encountered people who claim to be Vietnam veterans who are as vicious and hateful toward POW/MIA activists as those I recently met on two Vietnam War related Internet newsgroups — alt.war.vietnam (AWV) and soc.history.war.vietnam (SHWV).

Newsgroups (originally designated "Use-Net Groups") are collections of articles on subjects of general interest and specific topics (in this case, the Vietnam War) where anyone with a computer and modem can access other people's articles or publish their own works to be seen by the world on the Internet.

There are many different newsgroups on the Internet, with a variety of "Paths" or "addresses" in place of an Internet URL (or WWW address).

You can find a particular newsgroup by replacing the "http://" with "news:" and the path or address of the newsgroup that you wanted to view or participate in.

To get to AWV, in place of a "www" address, you would type: news:alt.war.vietnam and then subscribe to AWV. You will then be able to read the notes, called "postings," contained in AWV through your browser such as Microsoft Internet Explorer or Netscape.

If you want to visit SHWV, type news:soc.history.war.vietnam and then subscribe to that newsgroup.

There are two types of newsgroups _ moderated and un-moderated.

Alt.war.vietnam is an unmoderated newsgroup on the "alternative" server. Soc.history.war.vietnam is a moderated newsgroup on the "society" server.

Newsgroups AWV and SHWV are meeting places restricted to comment and debate about the Vietnam War. Participants are not required to be Vietnam veterans.

However, a word of caution. Because it is impossible to check credentials, anyone can post claiming to be a Vietnam veteran and get away with it. So no one knows for sure who is who or what on the newsgroups.

Moderated newsgroups are usually chartered, and the charter can be viewed on the group's web page. Select members of this type of group act as moderators and preview all postings, deciding whether or not to allow the submitted comments to be posted.

AWV is an un-moderated newsgroup.

An un-moderated newsgroup is one that is wide-open and frequently a free-for-all, "anything goes," type of newsgroup. (The Family Channel it isn't!)

Moderated versus un-moderated is a typical double-edged sword. Moderated groups are designed to be more sedate and professional in nature while the un-moderated ones are more along the lines of the "wild west" or a verbal free fire zone on the Internet — anyone with any opinion can say or post anything they like, and they usually do.

Most of the so-called "moderators" for SHWV post frequently on AWV where they are openly hateful and obviously prejudiced against POW/MIA activists.

The SHWV moderators often give preferential treatment to several former (and present) Pentagon officials who frequently post on SHWV. Those officials have a history of attempting to discredit the live POW/MIA issue and its activists. This special relationship between those espousing a pro-Pentagon bias and SHWV brings into question the credibility of the entire SHWV program

On AWV, the SHWV moderators often join a number of other posters including retired Col. Joe Schlatter, the former Deputy Director of the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) POW/MIA office together with at least three other present and former DIA officials. Collectively, they take no prisoners in their attacks on the POW/MIA activists who post there.

SHWV moderator, Frank Vaughan, who posts on AWV is often brutal in his attacks. He signs off on his posts as "The Manchurian Moderator." This is a mocking reference to symbolize his disbelief that former POW Sen. John McCain collaborated with the Vietnamese communist while he was a POW. In fact, Vaughan defends McCain quite often.

In a February post on AWV, Vaughan referred to the POW/MIA activists as "ilk preying on the memories of noble men." He wrote in another post "after dealing with the MIA cultists in this and other news groups, 30 years in a communist cave is beginning to look pretty good."

Vaughan sarcastically declares in his postings that he has been "assigned to this newsgroup to foil the zealots who are on the fringe of MIA activities (sic) movement, and whose only known language is the pejorative."

In a March post, Vaughan wrote, "I contend there is a world of difference between `abandoning' and `not believing their bullsh-t'."

Lee Parsons, another frequent poster, wrote to Vaughan, "Don't let the `abandoning' bullsh-t get to you. They [POW/MIA activists] thump their chest in self-righteousness as if you and I owed something to those who went missing or even to the enthusiasts themselves! We don't."

As if to lend credibility to himself, Lee concluded "I used to be like them, until I learned." He never specified what he learned.

In another post, Lee asked, "Why does someone being listed MIA make them and their families holy? Does it imbue them with some special rights and require some special treatment of relatives other than that of the other dead listed on the wall?"

Retired colonel Joe Schlatter, a former deputy director for the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), posted in February, "The belief in live U.S. POWs in Southeast Asia is a myth that originates from the `pseudohistory' promulgated by various MIA `enthusiasts,' from policies of Republican administrations bent on making Vietnam pay for outlasting us on the battlefield, and from U.S. government pronouncements and activities based, not in serious analysis, but in pandering to family, veteran and activist groups."

To that, Tom Dier, wrote, "I have been following my instincts on this for many years and concluded a long time ago that the people of Vietnam were being punished for something that, quite possibly, was out of their control.

"The people of Vietnam suffered greatly during the war, and have had to bear the brunt of our government's refusal of diplomatic and economic relations of the government of VN in the past," Dier concluded.

Ronald Kunkel wrote in an attack on the POW/MIA activists, "You fanatics have killed the last POW, and hidden the remains of the remaining MIA. You do hate veterans and all that once truly cared. You are the Satan and traitors to God, country and man."

A poster who calls himself Slowboy wrote, "At one time, I felt that some live POWs might have been left behind. Over the years, thanks to the Internet, I've become convinced that this is no longer the case, if it ever was."

"Why do you continue? No one here desires your information. Please go away," Chet Botkins wrote in response to an activist.

Andrew Gilbert also demanded that the activists go away. He suggested to another news group, which he noted had been specially created to rid AWV and SHWV of the POW?MIA activists.

Gilbert wrote, "A news group has been set up for you and others to discuss the POW problem . . . AWV is a place for all veterans to communicate with each other. It is not a soapbox for you, your friends, or enemies . . . I just removed my POW bracelet and am placing it in the trash can."

A poster identifying himself as Thumper II wrote, " . . . a lot of good folks have refrained from posting here while this infestation of the jerks continues. I miss the good times we've had here. The sooner the `activists' wander over to their own group, the better off all of us will be."

The other newsgroup that Gilbert and Thumper II were referring to is alt.war.pow-mia. It was created by John Tegtmeier the "lead" moderator of SHWV who was hoping the "MIA Cultists" would leave AWV.

Vaughan and several of his supporters on AWV have recently taken to taunting the activists with "How many MIAs did you bring home today?"

They insist for the activists to provide them with absolute proof that communist Vietnam is still holding "living" U.S. POWs including the exact coordinates of where the prisoners are being held.

Tegtmeier and the other moderators who regulate the supposedly politically "neutral" SHWV newsgroup are blatantly biased against the POW/MIA activists posters.

The SHWV moderators have demonstrated very clearly that they are zealously pro-Pentagon often giving special consideration to the posts of the former and present Department of Defense (DOD) officials.

Most of the POW/MIA related books that challenge the government's official POW/MIA position are not mentioned on the SHWV Homepage recommended reading list and suggestions for further reading and research. Books like "Kiss The Boys Goodbye," "The Men We Left Behind," "Moscow Bound," "Why Didn't You Get Me Out?" etc.

There are several fairly well known and respected activists that have been attempting to engage the DoD/DIA personnel on these newsgroups, and at almost every interval, they have been attacked and maligned several times.

The activists posting to SHWV are often blocked, and when the rejection instructions are followed and they move their posts to AWV, the activists are vehemently attacked by the SHWV moderators.

When I tried posting the facts respective to Sen. John McCain's collaboration with the enemy while a prisoner of war as well as some of his post-war conduct, the moderators rejected the my post stating, "Your message is deemed to have contained a personal attack against another individual. The newsgroup charter is clear on this, you cannot attack others."

I then posted the McCain note, as well as their rejection remarks, on the un-moderated AWV.

The response was swift and mean.

SHWV moderator Vaughan answered on AWV, "Well, Mr. Sampley of Last T-Shirtbase, I mean Firebase, has now joined the fray. Yep, the article was rejected . . . Mr. Sampley is not interested in posting on SHWV nor in engaging in a debate on the issues which the newsgroup deals with. He is interested in attempting to discredit a venue where present

and former members of the DIA, DPMO and Senate Select Committee have an opportunity to count his view of reality."

While the SHWV moderators consider it a personal attack to ask Col. Schlatter to explain his conduct during his stint at DIA, they find it OK for Col. Schlatter to refer to POW/MIA activists as "MIA Enthusiasts" or "cultists."

When POW/MIA family member Steve Golding demanded on AWV that Col. Schlatter explain what role he played in the Pentagon's "faking" of the Vietnam Unknown Soldier and when he knew about it, Col. Schlatter responded that the Reagan Administration ordered the Pentagon to come up with the remains that were interred in the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier. He admonished Golding about "constitutional civilian authority" in a lame attempt to explain why DoD allowed the POW/MIA issue to be manipulated by the politicians.

T. H. Rau responded that Col. Schlatter's response was well thought out and that Golding would understand better if he was a veteran!

Another moderator, Craig Thompson, demanded that a POW/MIA family member-activist post the name of the MIA he was related to and how they were related. Thompson called the omission of this information an oddity and insinuated that the omission was something sinister rather than a highly personal choice.

Visiting these newsgroups is truly an experience.

Do not go to AWV unless you are thick-skinned and willing to turn a cheek when someone who may or may not be a Vietnam veteran, possibly thousands of miles away and using a fake name, cowardly types insults about things that may be sacred to you.

Don't go to the moderated SHWV expecting to read both sides of the POW/MIA issue. Much of the activist point of view cannot be found there, because it has been censored.

In any case, AWV and SHWV are visited by thousands of people from all over the world, and it is important to keep the activist point of view alive and well as a counter to the Pentagon's propaganda frequently found on the newsgroups.